"That's above my pay grade..." It certainly is! -- Tony

The Saddleback Civil Forum on the Presidency was the first opportunity that I (and many others) actually got to hear the candidates address these issues directly. You can access the transcripts here, and the videos are on youtube. Like everyone else I've read McCain's webpage and Obama's blueprint, but this was the first time I got to listen to them answer questions and get a feel for their sincerity and personalities. What's ironic about this forum is that for Social conservatives this election presents possibly the worse two candidates in our history, yet the first time there's been a forum specifically to address the issues of social conservatives. It's a very sad time for family values voters when your conservative choice is contemplating picking a Pro-choice VP.

So why did we have the forum in the first place? Why in a church? Because this year, like never before in history, faith based voters may turn out to be the swing vote. A group that constantly votes republican because of their morals is now faced with a decision for the first time.....Or so the Democrats think.

I mean this venue is like the lions den for a far left, gay friendly, pro baby killing candidate like Obama, right? I mean that's how we people of faith see people who take Obama's positions on issues. So why in the world would he take the risk of answering these questions in front of this audience? Because the potential gain if he did what he wanted to do outweighed the almost invisible negative effects. See conservatives who vote based on abortion or other faith based issues are not going to vote for Obama, he realizes that. He has no chance of converting them. But there is a large group out there that takes into account other things in addition to value issues. If he can convince that group that he's not a "baby killing" anti-christ, he
may be able to get their votes.

Why did McCain feel he needed to participate? He's the Republican candidate, those voters should know where he stands right? WRONG! People don't know how McCain really is on these issues. His webpage says he is Pro-Life, but he supports Embryonic stem cell research. He touts his conservative nature, but is considering a Democratic Pro-Choice VP? People are confused. McCain needed this opportunity to strengthen his faith based core and show his Christian values to the world.

I settled down on the couch to watch the whole forum in its entirety. I tried to get Jaime to watch with me, but she refused. She said she doesn't want to sit there and listen to me yell at the TV and try to convince her how smart I am. What's up with that?

It was actually the opposite. I know Obama's positions on moral issues, I knew what to expect, so I didn't go into this to get mad at him. I really did want to hear how he would address an issue like abortion when he voted against a bill that would essentially get rid of Partial Birth Abortions. I also wanted to hear McCain address moral issues, because if you've read his book, he is not the most moral person in the world...or religious.

Who came out on top? McCain. Point blank.

I discussed this with several of my Obama supporting friends who are very intelligent and gave some good reasoning, but I feel that Obama didn't gain any ground through this forum. McCain absolutely helped put his value voters at ease. Obama's typical tap dance around the questions was to be expected, I mean he is against everything the forum was about, so he had no choice. I think he really feels as though he can talk around an issue so well as to trick people into thinking he's right. For me I hate this approach. I look at it like that Car salesman everyone hates. You do the research you go to the lot and the salesman comes out. You know he is going to get all sales-ee on you, it's his job, but when they start throwing out lies and try to "convince" you to buy the car, that's when I'm out. I mean, I hate when they insult my intelligence by telling me that the car is selling below what the dealership paid and that him throwing in that 1500 undercoating is because he likes me.....That's how I felt when Obama was answering the questions. I wanted him to say "I don't believe life starts at conception, that's why I support abortion"... there is a clear answer. But when he says "I don't know when life begins, that's above my pay grade" I'm thinking to myself, yes, you are correct that is above your pay grade, so why do you feel it's within your pay grade to decide if they should be killed or not? If you don't know, why take the chance? To me his overly gracious "the world needs to be more giving" answers came across as phony. Just a well thought out answer that would appease the majority. That's just how I took it.

McCain's whole goal in attending this forum was to show he has values and appeal to conservatives. He did this. His quick one sentence answers were strong and poignant. "Life begins at conception, that's why I'm Pro-Life and why I'll be a pro-life president". Straight answer. Again this was easy because of the venue and audience, I realize that. He will probably put on his tap dance shoes when the forum on the Economy comes around. When asked about his greatest moral failure, he gave a three word answer: "My First Marriage". Done. When asked about which three supreme court justices he would not have appointed, he shot off three names directly and without hesitation, unlike Obama who skirted and danced around the question before giving the name Clarence Thomas.

You can say a lot of negative things about McCain, he's old, he's hardheaded, he's a bull. But one thing about him is that he says what he thinks and stands beside his statement whether it's popular or not. And if his decision to surge troops in Iraq way back in 2006 is any indication, he knows what he is doing. Obama gets points from me for even attending the forum, because he knew he was going to be answering these questions and knew he wasn't giving the popular answer.

Obama will have a stronger showing in the economic debates because that's his whole platform, he has that stuff well rehersed. I am interested to get Eric's take on the forum.